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YEEE-HAAAA!!!

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Please add new discussions at the bottom of the page!

Contents 1 Stubs 2 T3s? 3 NowCommons: File:NortheastvalleyNZ.jpg 4 Your username 5 Stubbing 6 FYI 7 Removal of PROD from Jaz 8 Hello Grutness 9 Southland 10 Where can I drop a list? 11 {{Recent death}} 12 Award 13 Backlogs at WikiProject Stub sorting 14 Thanks for your note. 15 Swaminarayan stubs 16 Drei Schwestern 17 The "Delicious Tuesday" 18 Australian Open? 19 Squash (sport) → Squash 20 Your concerns 21 botanic-garden-stub and arboretum-stub 22 Hi 23 Hi 2 24 Template:PHHstubfooter 25 I apologise for my obsession with duck stubs two years ago 26 DYK for 1979 Abbotsford landslip 27 bethune's gully 28 viceregal rulers 29 Why are you deleting historical data? 30 User:Alan Liefting 31 Usage and Abusage 32 Thank you 33 Category:Georgia (country) international footballers 34 -stubs / -stub 35 AfD nomination of List of United States towns with the same name as subnational regions 36 AfD nomination of List of shibboleths

I've moved earlier discussions to archive pages (as listed below). A few of the items I've simply got rid of - if I have, it's simply that it was trivial and/or stuff which has been dealt with, and is therefore no longer relevant. The deletion is not a reflection of my opinion of the writers!

Archives

10/04-01/05	02/05	03-04/05	04-05/05
05/05	06/05	07/05	07/05
08/05	09/05: 1	09/05: 2	10/05
11/05	12/05	01/06	02/06

03-04/06	05-06/06	07-08/06	09-10/06
11-12/06	01/07	02-03/07	04-05/07
06/07	07-08/07	09-10/07	11-12/07
01-02/08	03-04/08	05/08	06-07/08

08-09/08	10/08	11-12/08	01/09
02-03/09	04-05/09	06-07/09	08-09/09*

* = still to archive

[edit] Stubs

No need to be so rude - we aren't all as clever as you. The Red Hat of Pat Ferrick ^t 01:21, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

Not being rude, just stating a fact. If you're unsure what a template is for, check. The template itself says that it's for "short articles", as does WP:STUB. There is no excuse for using a template that is clearly wrong. Grutness...wha? 01:33, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

No, you were being extremely rude, and still are. What there is no excuse for is your tone towards other editors, not simple and honest mistakes. We aren't all PhDs in the intricacies of Wikipedia's templates. The reasonable thing to do is politely point out the mistake. The Red Hat of Pat Ferrick ^t 01:45, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

As far as I know no-one's got the knowledge to know what all of Wikipedia's templates are for. That's part of the reason why we have pages like Wikipedia:Cleanup templates, so that if you don't know the right template, or if the template you've used is clearly not the right one, you can find out which template should be used. And certainly there's nothing rude in saying that you should check what you're adding to an article. I have no qualms with simple and honest mistakes if the person whose made them - once they realises it - tries to correct them. And anyone adding a stub template to that article would have instantly found out their mistake when they checked what they'd added to the article (something which all editors should always do). I say again - if you put a template on an article and it's instantly apparent that it's wrong, change it. What's "rude" is putting a wrong template on the article and not even bothering to try to correct it even when it's obvious it's wrong, but rather leaving it for some other editor to come and clean up the mistakes later. That's not a "simple, honest mistake" - that's bad wikiquette. You wouldn't add a redlink category to an article without at least trying to find the right name for the category, so why do basically the same sort of thing by adding a template which clearly says that it is for a small article to a 47 kb article? Grutness...wha? 01:59, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

There is nothing rude in pointing out someone's error. There is something rude in being sarcastic like you were. Totally uncalled for. The Red Hat of Pat Ferrick ^t 02:01, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

I wasn't being sarcastic. Grutness...wha? 02:04, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

[edit] T3s?

Is this a T3 candidate: Template:Diving-bio-stub ? No transclusions. (Template:Diving-stub has only 1 left, as well). –xeno^talk 19:45, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

k, just wanted to double check. Do you think such stubs should include the article in a hidden category, Category:Articles using deprecated stub templates? –xeno^talk 00:21, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

[edit] NowCommons: File:NortheastvalleyNZ.jpg

File:NortheastvalleyNZ.jpg is now available on Wikimedia Commons as Commons:File:NortheastvalleyNZ.jpg. This is a repository of free media that can be used on all Wikimedia wikis. The image will be deleted from Wikipedia, but this doesn't mean it can't be used anymore. You can embed an image uploaded to Commons like you would an image uploaded to Wikipedia, in this case: [[File:NortheastvalleyNZ.jpg]]. Note that this is an automated message to inform you about the move. This bot did not copy the image itself. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 09:51, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

File:GardensfromProspectParkDn.jpg is now available as Commons:File:GardensfromProspectParkDn.jpg. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 09:53, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

File:KnoxChurchDunedin.jpg is now available as Commons:File:KnoxChurchDunedin.jpg. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 04:26, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

File:DunedinFirstChurch-back.jpg is now available as Commons:File:DunedinFirstChurch-back.jpg. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 07:36, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

File:Dunedinjewishcemetery.jpg is now available as Commons:File:Dunedinjewishcemetery.jpg. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 03:18, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

File:ManaIsland.jpg is now available as Commons:File:ManaIsland.jpg. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 15:55, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

File:NZ-Gt Barrier I.png is now available as Commons:File:NZ-Gt Barrier I.png. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 11:21, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

File:MtCargillDunedin.jpg is now available as Commons:File:MtCargillDunedin.jpg. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 00:38, 24 September 2009 (UTC)

File:DnRlyStnClocktower.jpg is now available as Commons:File:DnRlyStnClocktower.jpg. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 00:38, 24 September 2009 (UTC)

File:CavershambaptistNZ.jpg is now available as Commons:File:CavershambaptistNZ.jpg. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 05:17, 24 September 2009 (UTC)

File:PalmerstonNorth.jpg is now available as Commons:File:PalmerstonNorth.jpg. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 05:18, 24 September 2009 (UTC)

File:Manapourimonument.jpg is now available as Commons:File:Manapourimonument.jpg. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 08:14, 4 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Your username

Hi Grutness, just stopped by to say that I don't know why but I love your username. This word, Grutness, should be included in English dictionary and should mean the dogged determination to do something. Well, don't ask me why. I know it is just a weird thought. - DSachan (talk) 20:32, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

Hi DSachan - glad you like it. It's actually a place in Scotland (see Grutness). I spotted it while looking through an atlas several years ago and started using it as the name of a small magazine I was editing. It sort of stuck, and now I use it both for my art (see here and as a username online, both in Wikipedia and elsewhere. Grutness...wha? 01:32, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Stubbing

Hi Grutness,thanks for the heads-up about the accepted convention.I actually thought stub tags should be added at the top so that readers can contribute if they can,on seeing a very visible tag.Guess I was wrong. :) EaswarH (talk) 08:14, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

[edit] FYI

You participated in a discussion, on which I have now made a proposal. Please see Wikipedia_talk:Stub#Lines_before_stub_template if you like. Debresser (talk) 16:56, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Removal of PROD from Jaz

Hello Grutness, this is an automated message from SDPatrolBot to inform you the PROD template you added to Jaz has been removed. It was removed by Youngamerican with the following edit summary '(rv back to dab, artist flunks WP:N)'. Please consider discussing your concerns with Youngamerican before pursuing deletion further yourself. If you still think the article should be deleted after communicating with the 'dePRODer,' you may want to send the article to AfD for community discussion. Thank you, SDPatrolBot (talk) 21:32, 18 August 2009 (UTC) (Learn how to opt out of these messages)

[edit] Hello Grutness

I saw your edit to Lisa Vidal and I told myself, "Wow, I haven't seen Grutness around here for sometime". I am sorry to learn about your health problems, but I can certainly understand how the stress created by a person's work here can affect someone's health. Anyway, take care of yourself because you are truly one of the great ones. Tony the Marine (talk) 00:54, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

replied on Tony's talk page. Grutness...wha?

[edit] Southland

Perhaps the search term "Southland" returns many links to the "Southland Region" when you are using Google New Zealand (http://www.google.co.nz) but the US version of Google (http://www.google.com) returns many pages of links to the very popular NBC TV show Southland -- it is by far the number one item. I see no mention of the Southland Region of New Zealand until the sixth page, where the Wikipedia page finally shows up.

Leaflet (talk) 01:07, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

The US version of google seems to be the only one which returns the TV series first. And the article on that series has long been at Southland (TV series) simply because it wasn't the primary use of the term. In any case, as I said, over 90% of the links to Southland were to the place in New Zealand - the TV series wasn't even second on that list: The Southland, an area of Los Angeles, was. Grutness...wha? 01:15, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Where can I drop a list?

I want to start putting 'entire list of templates ending in -stub' somewhere central for you guys. Maybe even having a DBR bot update it weekly. Where would the best place for this to go? –xeno^talk 18:10, 29 August 2009 (UTC)

[edit] {{Recent death}}

Please see this discussion which is related to a proposed change to {{Recent death}}. An example of how this change would appear is on this userpage. --Brian McNeil /^talk 00:16, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Award

		The Kakapo Award
		In recognition of all your New Zealand-related work, I award you the Kakapo award. — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 09:48, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

Thank you! I shall move it to a safe pace when I next archive here. Much appreciated! :) Grutness...wha? 01:39, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Backlogs at WikiProject Stub sorting

Hello, Grutness. Since I recall you're active to stub sorting jobs per {{Korea-cuisine-stub}}, I'm drawing your attention to the backlogs at Wikipedia:WikiProject Stub sorting/Proposals/2009/September. Thanks.--Caspian blue 16:44, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks for your note.

It is very much appreciated. Rich Farmbrough, 09:55, 10 September 2009 (UTC).

[edit] Swaminarayan stubs

I noticed that you have recently removed Swaminarayan stub templates from various articles. Kindly note that I have reverted the same as it is important the stubs are marked for WP:Swaminarayan. If all these are marked as Swaminarayan stubs, then members of the WP can easily see which articles need expansion. Around The Globe^{सत्यमेव जयते} 11:19, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Sorry was unaware of all this procedure - this stub type was not created by me - I noticed it as v wer using it fr the WP. Around The Globe

^{सत्यमेव जयते} 11:33, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, wil go thru tht with the other project members. Around The Globe^{सत्यमेव जयते} 11:39, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Drei Schwestern

Are you sure Kuhgrat is part of the Drei Schwestern? I have a map which implies that whilst there are 3 peaks in a row east of Schaan it is the northernmost of these that is Drei Schwestern and Garsellakopf and Kuhgrat are separate mountains. This page certainly gives heights for the secondary peaks of Drei Schwestern that don't match the heights of Garsellakopf and Kuhgrat. JMiall₰ 21:26, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

[edit] The "Delicious Tuesday"

This was an article dedicated to something recently invented by myself and a few friends. I felt it was explained clearly and was not "patent nonsense". I would enjoy some kind of explanation as to its removal. I remain with an open mind Enickx (talk) 01:20, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

I suggest you read WP:NFT. That should provide all the necessary information for why the article was deletable. Grutness...wha? 01:26, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Australian Open?

Hello, I did this to keep the chain unbroken in the infoboxes, which go look at the 1985 Australian Open and 1987 Australian Open, which no longer is connected! If you got a better solution, I would love to see it!98.240.44.215 (talk) 01:21, 16 September 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, i can see the problem. Creating a stub just so as to say "this didn't exist" is definitely frowned upon in Wikipedia though. I've left a message on the talkpage of that template - hopefully someone will have a better solution. Grutness...wha?

[edit] Squash (sport) → Squash

You are invited to participate in a discussion at Talk:Squash Arteyu ? _{Blame it on me !} 17:18, 24 September 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Your concerns

I have made my points on Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#Over-zealous NPPer. I hope that is ok with you. 13:28, 27 September 2009 (UTC)

[edit] botanic-garden-stub and arboretum-stub

Grutness, I just got back from a family shindig and saw your comments from this weekend on my talk page and WP:WPSS/P. As you have suggestions on wpss, I'll respond to them there. --Rosiestep (talk) 18:35, 28 September 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Hi

Hi (Glad to find a stub-sorter). Can you please determine if the Superman: Ultimate Flight article is a stub? I find it more than ten sentences, but at the bottom, it indicates that the article is a stub. Chevy Impala 2009 (Sign me!) 01:09, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Hi 2

Hi,

Thank you for your support.

I just come to subscribe to the wikipedia program. I know that my article about this journalist doesn't cite any references. This is why I would like to add the external links that I have found, for writing my article. But the problem is: I don't know how to add them to the article.

I would like to add, also a picture of this journalist who died 10 years ago now. I am the owner of this photo. I have permission to post this photo. How can I do?

Thank you in advance, for your understanding,

Sarah —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sarah Dimanta (talk • contribs) 17:38, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Template:PHHstubfooter

Hi, sorry, Template:PHHstubfooter was my fault, it is used for the page random content stubs to expand. And I was in a scheme to create this subpage, so I misnamed. Thanks for fixing. Cheers. Sebastian scha. (talk) 10:03, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] I apologise for my obsession with duck stubs two years ago

Stephen J. Brooks (talk) 23:52, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

No problem - to be honest I'd forgotten all about it. Ancient history -but thakns for the apology anyway :) Grutness...wha? 05:08, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] DYK for 1979 Abbotsford landslip

On October 11, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article 1979 Abbotsford landslip, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

JamieS93 21:28, 11 October 2009 (UTC)

1500 views. Not bad, but no banana. Grutness...wha?

[edit] bethune's gully

i'm sure the controversial part was templated. nice filling-in you did! hope you have a great walk there soon - i'm a dunedin writer (for now) myself. Kasyapa (talk) 21:51, 20 October 2009 (UTC)kasyapa

[edit] viceregal rulers

• I am not sure patriarchs of Constantinople are even "rulers"-- but if they are-- the Roman Pope is considered a monarch.
  Regents are viceregal rulers, e.g. Category:10th-century viceregal rulers-- but let be know of any you find. Some monarchs were regents first. ^{Carlaude:Talk} 02:36, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Why are you deleting historical data?

Can you give a reason other than your personal stance on religion for deleting "# List of nontheists (surnames E to G) and

1. List of nontheists (surnames H to K)?

Rebturtle (talk) 07:50, 29 October 2009 (UTC) RebTurtle

Sure. Both lists were completely empty - there were no names on the lists. That's why they were deleted CSD-A3 ("no meaningful substantive content"). The entirety of the second of those articles, at the time of its deletion, was one line: "Atheists with surnames starting H to K, sortable by the field for which they are mainly known and nationality" plus a cleanup template.

As to my "personal stance", not that it's any of your business, I am a non-theist. Please don't make assumptions about a person's motives when none - other than the functionality of Wikipedia - are there. Grutness...wha? 09:41, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] User:Alan Liefting

Hi Grutness, I note your posting on Alan's talk page: [1], do you think it is time to ask again? I would but I am not sure about what sort of criteria needs to be meet for a request for adminship, and I know you will! I would be willing to support a nomination :) Kiwiteen123 (talk) 08:19, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Almost certainly worthwhile, and I'm sure Alan would meet all the criteria. By coincidence I asked another Kiwi today whether he'd reconsidered his earlier decision not to stand for admin, but I'd forgotten that Alan wasn't an admin yet. If you want to ask him, feel free (it's easy enough to nominate someone, and I'd definitely be keen toa dd my name to the nom. Grutness...wha? 09:46, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Alan stood for adminship in 2006. I'd say that the main reason he failed was that he didn't give sufficient answers to the standard questions, and was absent from Wikipedia during the RFA, and so could not elaborate his answers to match criticism of them. I think it would have gone much better if he'd been able to respond to the first few opposes.

Undoubtedly he's a much more experienced Wikipedian now, but he does take a relatively strong deletionist position, and frequently nominates articles for speedy deletion which do not meet the criteria. He believes that the speedy deletion criteria are too narrow. I think any current RFA would meet opposition due to this; I think he would need to make an undertaking to be very conservative in deleting articles as an admin. He could campaign to change speedy deletion criteria, but he doesn't need to be an admin to do this.-gadfium 19:06, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Forgive my butting in, but I agree with Gadfium's assessment. Alan makes CSD requests that are do no meet the current criteria. Frequently. Personally I agree with Alan that CSD should be widened to allow greater scope for disposal. Nevertheless in the current RfA environment any nomination of Alan for Adminship would, in my opinion, not be successful. Crafty (talk) 19:23, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Hi all, I personally would still nominate Alan however I feel that the points you raise, Gadfium, need to be discussed in order to improve Alan's chances. Perhaps this should be moved onto its own page User talk:Kiwiteen123/Alan Liefting Nomination or similar?? But it could just stay here, I will have a look at his edits then reply to Gadfium's comment (not that I'm much of an expert), Kiwiteen123 (talk) 02:40, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

Closed Alan has stated on his talk page that he does not wish to be an admin. A real shame... But it's his decision! Kiwiteen123 (talk) 03:07, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Usage and Abusage

Dated it is, but it is still a favourite of mine, along with Simon's Paradigms Lost. I first read the latter on a trans-Atlantic flight, chortling to myself at frequent intervals. The stranger in the seat beside me wanted to know what was so funny. I read an exerpt aloud, barely able to keep sufficient composure to form the words. When I finished, tears in my eyes, he stared at me for several seconds, then stood up, and walked towards the rear of the plane. I didn't see him again, not even when leaving the plane. True story. Thanks for the further explanation of "awhile" versus "a while"; mine lacked clarity. Bielle (talk) 02:33, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

Replied on Bielle's talk page. Grutness...wha?

[edit] Thank you

This troublesome paradox has now been defeated by a combination of wiki and logic. Now it is in fact correct. Many thanks. --Beligaronia (talk) 08:09, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Category:Georgia (country) international footballers

Hi, you commented on the speedy rename nomination of the above category. I have now started a CfR to get proper consensus; the discussion can be found here. Regards, GiantSnowman 01:01, 10 November 2009 (UTC)

[edit] -stubs / -stub

I thought I had moved all these, I'll double check though thanks. Waacstats (talk) 17:30, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

I forgot they left redirects, If these could be deleted I would be grateful. And congratulations to NZ on the 'Soccer' World cup Qualification. Waacstats (talk) 19:10, 15 November 2009 (UTC)

[edit] AfD nomination of List of United States towns with the same name as subnational regions

An editor has nominated one or more articles which you have created or worked on, for deletion. The nominated article is List of United States towns with the same name as subnational regions. We appreciate your contributions, but the nominator doesn't believe that the article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion and has explained why in his/her nomination (see also Wikipedia:Notability and "What Wikipedia is not").

Your opinions on whether the article meets inclusion criteria and what should be done with the article are welcome; please participate in the discussion(s) by adding your comments to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of United States towns with the same name as subnational regions. Please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~).

You may also edit the article during the discussion to improve it but should not remove the articles for deletion template from the top of the article; such removal will not end the deletion debate.

Please note: This is an automatic notification by a bot. I have nothing to do with this article or the deletion nomination, and can't do anything about it. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 01:09, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

[edit] AfD nomination of List of shibboleths

An editor has nominated one or more articles which you have created or worked on, for deletion. The nominated article is List of shibboleths. We appreciate your contributions, but the nominator doesn't believe that the article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion and has explained why in his/her nomination (see also Wikipedia:Notability and "What Wikipedia is not").

Your opinions on whether the article meets inclusion criteria and what should be done with the article are welcome; please participate in the discussion(s) by adding your comments to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of shibboleths. Please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~).

You may also edit the article during the discussion to improve it but should not remove the articles for deletion template from the top of the article; such removal will not end the deletion debate.

Please note: This is an automatic notification by a bot. I have nothing to do with this article or the deletion nomination, and can't do anything about it. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 01:04, 20 November 2009 (UTC)